Chorus vs Chorus Delay

New to Rockman gear? Here's some help. Questions are welcome.
Sunburst
Posts: 222
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 12:46 am

Re: Chorus vs Chorus Delay

Post by Sunburst » Fri Dec 22, 2017 2:33 am

Yeah Bob, the 200ms on the Stereo Chorus/Delay just isn't enough for me for reverb. But the 250-300 on the Stereo Echo at a low volume is perfect!

;)

I thought about having a stereo spring reverb unit custom-made but it would violate my all-Rockman (OK, with a little MXR!) setups!

bbheli
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2017 2:09 pm

Re: Chorus vs Chorus Delay

Post by bbheli » Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:52 pm

RockmanCentralBob wrote:Try this:
Dual IC Sustainor> Rockman EQ> Stereo Chorus Delay> Stereo Echo> PMG 175 Amp > Left and Right Full Range Speaker Cabs

Once you have this sounding OK, then you can try adding a Pre-Distortion Loop EQ:
From Sustainor "Send" to EQ Input and from EQ Output to Sustainor "All Return".
Bob, thank you. That is where I had it at first and had very poor volume and used two different amps and had same results. It was suggested to me that the Rockman gear did not have the proper signal level which is why I was told to put the EQ last. I was told that all the devices were unity gain so there would be no boost unless EQ was at the end. I did not try that in the distortion look however so I will try that today.

Thank You

bbheli
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2017 2:09 pm

Re: Chorus vs Chorus Delay

Post by bbheli » Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:55 pm

Sunburst wrote:Bob,


Brett.

Bob's signal route is the standard I (and I assume most people) use. Some possible explanations for your problems:

1. Inop module and/or power amp (Thanks, Captain Obvious!).

2. Bad cable or cables (all it takes is one in the chain!).

3. No Ebtech Live Level Shifter (to keep the volume at a professional level).

4. Input level of Stereo Chorus/Delay, Stereo Chorus, and/or Stereo Echo set too high causing clipping (I keep all of mine at the lowest setting on -6 db).

5. Impedance mismatch between Stereo Chorus/Delay, Stereo Chorus, and/or Stereo Echo. The earlier Stereo Choruses and Stereo Echoes (generally below serial numbers 4,000) have an impedance issue that was later corrected.

When I have a problem like yours and have no idea what is causing it in the chain, I test each module individually. It can be a time consuming process with a full setup but it's really the only way. So test the Sustainor first, then add the post EQ, then add the Stereo Chorus/Delay or Stereo Chorus, then add the Stereo Echo, etc., etc., etc.
Chris - Thank you, if I follow the standard route mentioned where do I add the Ebtech? Also I will check the serial numbers for that impedance issue mentioned.

Thank You

Brett

RockmanCentralBob
Posts: 251
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:10 am

Re: Chorus vs Chorus Delay

Post by RockmanCentralBob » Sat Dec 23, 2017 8:12 pm

bbheli wrote:It was suggested to me that the Rockman gear did not have the proper signal level which is why I was told to put the EQ last.
I don't know about that... it's line level so I don't see why it shouldn't be strong enough for any power amp.
Hell, I've been running mine directly in to a Sony Receiver for almost 30 years and never had a problem with signal level.
I also have a full Rockman Stack with the Rockman 500 Power Amp and it works flawlessly.

Maybe you have some cable issues, or level padding on your amp input?
If you have a Home Stereo system, try running the output of your Stereo Echo into one of your Aux Inputs.
Again, it's line level so it won't hurt anything (in fact, it's designed to run at that level).

Sunburst
Posts: 222
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 12:46 am

Re: Chorus vs Chorus Delay

Post by Sunburst » Wed Dec 27, 2017 3:03 pm

Brett,

I put my Ebtech Line Level Shifter after the Stereo Echo before wherever I'm sending it (mixing board for my studio setup, power amp for my stage heads, etc.). Haven't needed one with an XPR (probably since all of the modules are in the effects loop) but it can make a big difference on a large Sustainor setup (six or more modules).

Very respectfully,

Chris

bbheli
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2017 2:09 pm

Re: Chorus vs Chorus Delay

Post by bbheli » Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:44 pm

Chris - I put it between the SE and the amp and no change.

Bob's signal route corrected the issue but I wanted to see if it would give additional pre amp gain using the Eb tech.

So here is the question I have now. I orginally had an EQ on left and right channels after the SE before the amp. Now that I have changed that to the path Bob suggeted, what does the EQ do in the effects loop as suggested and when is t operational simply when it's not by-passed or is there some other operation ?

Thx

Happy New Year.

Sunburst
Posts: 222
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 12:46 am

Re: Chorus vs Chorus Delay

Post by Sunburst » Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:51 pm

Brett,

If you have one EQ in the ALL RETURN loop, it will provide pre-clean and pre-distortion equalization all the time. If you use two EQs - one ALL RETURN and the other DIST RETURN - whichever channel you are using will be EQed accordingly. The pre-EQ is where you tailor your sound. The post-EQ fits your sound into the mix. Make sense?

Chris

bbheli
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2017 2:09 pm

Re: Chorus vs Chorus Delay

Post by bbheli » Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:55 pm

Ok, confused now, I read the signal path as first EQ goes from the output of the sus, so are you saying to change that ?

bbheli
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2017 2:09 pm

Re: Chorus vs Chorus Delay

Post by bbheli » Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:00 pm

By the way that makes sense but I dont get the wiring aspect of it.

I did this " Once you have this sounding OK, then you can try adding a Pre-Distortion Loop EQ:
From Sustainor "Send" to EQ Input and from EQ Output to Sustainor "All Return"."

The output of the second EQ is going to the input of the CD so where do I get a lead to return distorted - Do I need a splitter Y somehere ?

So how does the second EQ get wired in differnt from what I have now ?

Sunburst
Posts: 222
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 12:46 am

Re: Chorus vs Chorus Delay

Post by Sunburst » Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:08 pm

Here's how I wire the EQs in my Sustainor setups:

1. Pre-Clean: Effects Loop SEND into a MONO SPLITTER; one OUT to the Pre-Clean EQ and then back to ALL RETURN.

2. Pre-Distortion: Effects Loop SEND into the MONO SPLITTER; other OUT to the SMART GATE then OUT to the Pre-Distortion EQ and then back to DIST/EDGE RETURN.

3. Post: SUSTAINOR OUT to Post-EQ.